About 1,000 new lawmakers were elected in November’s election and will be joining their legislatures in the new year. Every legislature is different, of course, but for this episode we asked two veteran legislators to offer a little advice on a few issues that likely apply in most legislatures.
About 1,000 new lawmakers were elected in November’s election and will be joining their legislatures in the new year. Every legislature is different, of course, but we asked two veteran legislators to offer a little advice on a few issues that likely apply in most legislatures.
Sen. Karen Keiser (D) from Washington state and Rep. Walker Thomas (R) from Kentucky shared some of their experiences as new lawmakers and advice on working with the media, responding to constituents and speaking on the floor.
Keiser, who is retiring at the end of this term, is the president pro tem of the Washington Senate and is the author of “Getting Elected Is the Easy Part: Working and Winning in the State Legislature.” She started her career in the Washington House in 1995.
Thomas has served in the Kentucky House since 2017. He is the chair of Veterans, Military Affairs and Public Protection Committee.
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Ed: Hello and welcome to “Our American States,” a podcast from the National Conference of State Legislatures. I’m your host, Ed Smith.
KK: Be careful and be honest. Those are the two things I’d keep in mind as you deal with the media. Be careful of what you say and what they are after. Beware of what they are looking for.
Ed: That was Senator Karen Keiser from Washington State. One of my guests on this podcast along with Representative Walker Thomas from Kentucky. The two veteran legislators joined the podcast for a post-election tradition: Offering some advice to new legislators.
About 1,000 new lawmakers were elected in November’s election and will be joining their legislatures in the new year. Every legislature is different, of course, but I asked my guests for some advice on a few issues that likely apply in most legislatures. Senator Keiser is the president pro tem of the Washington Senate and also chairs the Labor and Commerce Committee. She has served in the Washington House since 1995 and is retiring at the end of this term. She’s also the author of “Getting Elected is the Easy Part: Working and Winning in the State Legislature.” Representative Thomas has served in the Kentucky House since 2017. He is the chair of the Veterans Military Affairs and Public Protection Committee.
Here is our discussion.
Representative Thomas, Senator Keiser, welcome to the podcast.
KK: Thank you.
WT: Thank you for having us.
Ed: Now you are both experienced legislators and I’m glad you had some time to offer some thoughts for new legislators who will be joining their legislatures next month. To start, I’d like to ask each of you what the biggest surprise was when you first joined the legislature and Senator Keiser, why don’t you start.
KK: Well, thank you, Ed. Thank you for doing this podcast as well. Way back when I first started the legislature, I was amazed at how many different viewpoints there were. I thought I was a pretty openminded person and I realized that there were a lot of people coming from other parts of the state who had a different, absolutely different take on things. Let me tell you the example that comes to mind. I was put on the natural resources committee my first term and there was another member on that committee and we were talking about voting safety. And there was a proposal to require that children had lifejackets on while in a boat in water. And my colleague from the other side of the aisle and the other side of the state said that would be an interference with parental rights to have that mandate and my jaw dropped. I couldn’t imagine where she was coming from or how she could say that. But I learned that that’s one of the really important parts of legislating is finding different perspectives from all over the state.
Ed: And how about for you Representative Thomas. What was the biggest surprise?
WT: You know, Ed, the biggest surprise for me is the amount of information that suddenly overflows you. You know they literally say you know it’s like drinking out of a firehose. Well for that first couple of weeks, it really is. I mean there is so much that comes at you. The next biggest thing was kind of that once you get elected, you might have your individual industry that you’ve been doing your whole life or something like that, but you have to have knowledge about every issue that could face the state of Kentucky. So, people come to and ask about a birthing center. Well, I didn’t even know what that was until I got elected. That’s the thing that these new reps be prepared. You’re going to get a lot of information and you are going to need to know a lot of information.
Ed: Well, I remember when I went to work at NCSL after more than 30 years in the newspaper business and I thought I knew my stuff pretty well. And I got to NCSL and I found out that, as you say, it was a firehose of information particularly about public policy that I think takes quite a while to just kind of get yourself settled into and accept that you are not going to know everything all of the time. So Representative Thomas, let me stick with you for just a minute. Did you have someone you could go to with questions about the legislative process, someone you could talk to about your own priorities when you first got in there, your first term.
WT: We actually flipped the house the year I came in so we weren’t not ever in a leadership role and then all of a sudden, we were. So, our leadership had set up like a buddy system so they took all of us incoming freshmen and assigned us to more of a senior member. And so, we did. We had someone that we could always turn to and kind of ask the questions especially the ones like where are the bathrooms and what time do, they serve lunch. You know, those things. What I found pretty quickly was the benefit of having NCSL out there. You know as you studied issues and different things like that, that was really a good source to be able to call someone and say can you research this for me. I might know what’s going on in the state of Kentucky, but I might not know what other states are doing and sometimes that is very pertinent on what kind of legislation we pass.
Ed: So, Senator Keiser, you are retiring after 30 years in the legislature and you’ve moved from the House to the Senate and I’d be interested in whether you had someone who showed you the ropes both when you first arrived in the House and in your subsequent move to the upper chamber.
KK: Back then there were really no support systems for new members. We’ve got some now. But back then when I arrived in the House, the Democrats had just been thrown into the minority for the first time in several terms. So, everybody was suffering from some kind of shock or PTSD and they really didn’t know how to act in the minority. And I didn’t know what to do either obviously as a new member so I just sat back and listened and watched. And maybe that was good and an advantage to be able to not jump directly into the fray, but to learn a little bit just by watching and listening to what others were doing. Now we do have sort of informal mentoring set up in our legislature and I think that’s much more helpful for new members.
Ed: I also wanted to ask you about leaderships since you are in leadership. And is that something first time legislators should be thinking about if that’s a direction they are interested in going or is that something for later on. And if it is something, what kind of steps should people take if they are interested in leadership?
TM: 7:00
KK: Every state is different of course. You know if you have term limits that give you just a couple of seasons and you are out. If you are interested in becoming kind of a leader and doing a step stone kind of approach to the legislature then that makes sense. I find a lot of people are elected to the legislature though with a passion for some kind of topic. It might be the environment or education or some other issue and if they come to the legislature with passion, it’s a great opportunity to really dig in by working on a committee for that topic and really becoming the go-to person on that topic for your chamber. So, it depends on the individual’s personal mission or goal for their legislative terms.
Ed: Representative Thomas, you chair the Veteran’s Military Affairs and Public Protection Committee there in Kentucky. And I wonder how you would advise a first-time legislator to approach committee work how to make the most of it.
WT: That came to me pretty quickly. I actually the third year I was in office, we had our committee chair resign to go on to do different things through his industry and it became open. And at that point, I represented about 25,000 soldiers of Fort Campbell Army post. And so, I was the natural fit to be able to take over that committee. But I encourage all of our new committee members to get out and try to find out all they can about the veterans. We tried our first few years; we would actually have some of our meetings in different places like on Fort Campbell Army post. And so, you can kind of get immersed in what might be going on the army installation. I already had one of our incoming freshmen reach out to me and he is actually interested in forming a veteran’s caucus. You wouldn’t have actually had to serve, but you could join this and if you really are focused on veteran’s issues that would be a great addition to our caucus.
Ed: I’ve heard people say--I’ve never been a legislator--but what I’ve heard people tell me is when it comes to speaking on the floor a little bit goes a long way. And I wonder what advice you’d offer folks about when to speak on the floor.
WT: As you come in as a freshman, you are very shy especially standing up and all the cameras are on you and you are speaking in front of your you know 99 other of your members and things. So, I did not speak a whole lot, but I remember the one time that you know you do get up and speak that all of a sudden everyone really focuses on you when you do if you don’t speak a lot. Everyone legislative body probably has quite a few that stand up and speak on every issue. I hate to say sometimes people kind of tune you out if you are hearing from them too often. So really less is best. When you stand up and talk and you haven’t stood up before in a month or something like that, they listen to you. And so, I would recommend that philosophy.
Ed: Senator, how do you see that issue of speaking on the floor?
KK: It’s a delicate choice. I think when you are in the minority, you tend to talk a lot because you don’t have any other power, but the power of your words on the floor. When you are in the majority, I think you might tend to be more circumspect and not put too much out that could become a vulnerability. So, you are more careful. You edit yourself more carefully. When you are in the minority, you stand and make all kinds of comments and are bombastic or argumentative or whatever your position is on the issue. And it really doesn’t persuade people. It’s really a performative process. It’s I think wise for anybody whether in minority or majority though to realize that the floor comments are for show and the real comments are personal.
Ed: So, if you are in the minority go right ahead and stand and deliver. But if you are in the majority you might want to be a little bit more circumspect. Good advice, I think. Let me ask you about another key thing that of course new legislators are not going to be very familiar with and that’s how to work with constituents. What kind of advice would you give on that?
KK: In my opinion, your constituents get first dibs on your time and attention. That’s who you work for whether they voted for you or not. That’s who you work for. That’s who you represent. So, when they take the time to contact you to come and visit you, you take the time to listen to them and that’s basically my attitude. I have many meetings with people that I don’t agree with. I’ve always learned something from them. And it’s still useful to communicate your opinion even if it is different from your constituents.
Ed: Representative, along with your constituents, you also have to interact with members of the media and with lobbyists. And I wonder how you suggest new legislators approach those interactions?
WT: You know what I found. I didn’t find immediately when I took office, but I would like to reach out to you know first time legislators and lets just note this that you do not have to respond immediately to them. So sometimes my phone would ring and it’s like oh I got to get this. It’s like no. Let it go to voicemail. Realize that you know the radio station or the TV station is calling you and they want to do something. Collect your thoughts because usually if they are calling you on like emergency, you know what it’s about. You know whether it be school choice or something like that and so kind of collect your thoughts and then call them back at your own time; your own leisure when you know what you are talking back. Most of the media is great about working with us on that. That’s what I’ve always found and Ed, I know you said you were in the newspaper business, too. My family had the newspaper since the late 1800s. So, they actually were in the newspaper business. I was the sixth generation.
Ed: Well Representative, as you know all too well, family newspapers are a dying breed. It sounds like your family held out longer than most. Senator Keiser, you also were in the news business. How would you advise new legislators when it comes to working with the media?
TM: 13:44
KK: Be careful and be honest. Those are the two things I’d keep in mind as you deal with the media. Be care of what you say and what they are after. Be aware of what they are looking for. And the other issue is you have to have honest conversations. You have to have credibility and you build that over time with individuals. Now there are so little local media coverage of legislatures at this point. It’s very difficult to build credibility and trust with a reporter because there are so few of them. So, it’s really a difficult time. It seems like everybody is into their own little silo and sometimes the media is coming from one of those silos that they have a particular persuasion and they are going to pursue it one way or the other. But I’ve always been open to responding to media inquiries, but I am careful about who they are and I am always honest about what I say. It’s not always easy.
Ed: Let me close with this. What was your best or worse moment or maybe both as a new legislator and Representative Thomas why don’t you go first.
WT: One of my favorite ones and people still mention to this so I was carrying a bill and it had to do with transportation, the licensing and something that how you license cars. And I filed the bill. And then all of a sudden, I got a lobbyist coming in and saying hey, I think we need to take this and we can make it better. So, we added amendment. And then another one came and said we can make this even better and we added amendment. Well, I got up in the session and while I was presenting the bill, I used a lot of kind of comedy in it and everyone was staring at me. They were laughing and it was just it was a lot of fun, but I’d sat there and said you know here we have this great bill and I filed it and said but low and behold, we can make it even greater. And then I called for an amendment and then it’s like but we’re not done yet. This great, great bill can even become greater. Called another amendment and by the time we added it all up everyone was kind of in stitches and stuff and it just kind of broke the mood a little bit. It was fun. I think it passed unanimous. I don’t think it was a controversial bill anyway. But it shows how you know you can take a bill and it can actually get better and better with some other people’s input.
Ed: How about for you Senator. Best or worse moment.
KK: Well, I’ve had both. I believe the best was when we passed on a bipartisan basis in the Senate our state’s paid family and medical dues law. And I had worked on that issue for some 15 years. So, it was an immense relief to actually get TS and to have bipartisan support so that I knew the program would stand that it wouldn’t be repealed you know when we lost the majority the next time. So that probably was the highlight of my entire 30 years. And my most embarrassing moment was right after I became Chair of the Senate Commerce and Labor Committee, I made a proposal on behalf of hairdresser salons. They have an ability to hire hairdressers rather than have independent contractors rent seats in their salon. So, I put that proposal forth on behalf of that industry and I did not know but when we had the hearing about a thousand hairdressers showed up to oppose it. And it was amazing. This was pre-Covid so they came in person. They had a line outside the building with people ready to testify against the bill and there were like 3 salons there to testify for it and a thousand hairdressers there to oppose it and it was amazing. I think it’s still probably the biggest response I ever got on any one bill.
Ed: I want to thank both of you so much. I probably could have asked you three dozen questions and not run through the entire list of issues that come up for new legislators but thank you both and thank you both for your service in the legislature. Take care.
KK: Thank you, Ed.
WT: Thank you, Ed, for having us.
Ed: I’ve been talking with Representative Walker Thomas of Kentucky and Senator Karen Keiser of Washington State about what new legislators can expect when they join their legislature in the new year. Thanks for listening.
You can check out all the podcasts from the National Conference of State Legislatures by searching for NCSL podcasts wherever you get your podcasts. This podcast “Our American States” dives into some of the most challenging public policy issues facing legislators. On “Across the Aisle” host Kelley Griffin tells stories of bipartisanship. Also check out our special series “Building Democracy” on the history of legislatures.
TM: 19:09